Curse

Grammar · Jan 01, 2008, 05:02 AM // 05:02

Burning Arrow has the highest raw DPS of any single-target ranger skill in the game (assuming burning is applicable).

If you're going for max DPS, always start with Burning Arrow, and then start stacking other things on top of it, such as poison, bleeding, preps, conjures, weapon spells, PvE skills, etc.

Veteran Shot · Jan 01, 2008, 03:58 PM // 15:58

A few decent damage non-elites are Sloth hunter's shot (A skill that hits hard when used correctly) and Keen arrow. (Nice when combined with a critical hit chance buff).

Moonlit Azure · Jan 02, 2008, 12:22 AM // 00:22

Bows cannot put out dps like an assassin or dervish, theyre unique in the sense that they can kill very nice(imo) through conditions and interrupts.

If you cut off their heal/attacks the only option left is death, and thats why I love the ranger.

The is ok dps: [skill]splinter weapon[/skill] and [skill]barrage[/skill]

Heres a basic interrupt bar that can do good damage and kill pretty swiftly on casters:

[skill]burning arrow[/skill] [skill]apply poison[/skill] [skill]distracting shot[/skill] and [skill]savage shot[/skill]

IllusiveMind · Jan 04, 2008, 10:00 PM // 22:00

That's the highest DPS I could get using Forked Arrow and Punishing Shot. That's 299 dmg. Looking to get more...

Alex the Great · Jan 04, 2008, 10:03 PM // 22:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grammar

Burning Arrow has the highest raw DPS of any single-target ranger skill in the game (assuming burning is applicable).

If you're going for max DPS, always start with Burning Arrow, and then start stacking other things on top of it, such as poison, bleeding, preps, conjures, weapon spells, PvE skills, etc.

needling shot, zojuns shot, point blank shot, conjure flame, kindle arrows, escape, troll unguent, d shot

i loled at this, but it works (problem is half range lol) around 70 dps there

Quaker · Jan 05, 2008, 12:13 AM // 00:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stormlord Alex

I'ts only BS if it's not true.

Bows are bad at DPS. They can be used for churning it out, but... then you'd be stuck playing a gimped character that frankly sucks compared to other alternatives.

Alex, Alex, Alex, do I have to explain this to you again!?

Yes there are "better" ways to do DPS, but frankly speaking, the differences aren't that great. But it seems to be the way teenagers are - if it's not the best, then it "sucks".

But, no, a bow doesn't "suck" - it's only marginally less. Bows are not "bad" at DPS, they're simply not quite as good as some other weapons. That doesn't mean that you should totally forget about doing damage with your ranger.

I mean, ok, maybe it takes only 20 seconds to kill something with an Axe (plus skills) and it takes 22 seconds with a bow (plus skills). OMG! Let's never do damage with a bow again cause they "suck" so bad!. Get serious!

Quaker · Jan 05, 2008, 12:17 AM // 00:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by IllusiveMind

That's the highest DPS I could get using Forked Arrow and Punishing Shot. That's 299 dmg. Looking to get more...

May I point out that DPS stands for Damage Per Second - which is damage over time, not the damage from one (or two) attacks. You seem to be looking for "spike" damage.

While I'm on the subject - here's something to consider. Burning arrow takes 5 seconds to recharge - so every 5 seconds you can do about +30 damage plus some burning - a total of something around +7 damage per second on average. Using Barrage, with a shortbow and IAS, you can do +15 damage every second. That's over twice the DPS of burning arrow.
Now, I know, there are other factors to consider - but that I guess is my point, there are many factors to consider - such as base damage, +dmg, rep rate, degen, etc. - when you are discussing DPS. It's not as simple as such & such skill does x damage. And definitely not as simple as "bows aren't good at DPS".

Wyat Hawke · Jan 05, 2008, 12:28 AM // 00:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quaker

Alex, Alex, Alex, do I have to explain this to you again!?

Yes there are "better" ways to do DPS, but frankly speaking, the differences aren't that great. But it seems to be the way teenagers are - if it's not the best, then it "sucks".

But, no, a bow doesn't "suck" - it's only marginally less. Bows are not "bad" at DPS, they're simply not quite as good as some other weapons. That doesn't mean that you should totally forget about doing damage with your ranger.

I mean, ok, maybe it takes only 20 seconds to kill something with an Axe (plus skills) and it takes 22 seconds with a bow (plus skills). OMG! Let's never do damage with a bow again cause they "suck" so bad!. Get serious!

Well, why would you not want the optimal instead of sub-par? When something achieves something to an "lesser" extent, it is worse. You can't argue around that. And when it's worse, why shouldn't it be bad.

Do not roll a ranger for just DPS. You can roll a ranger for utility, interrupt, degen and whatnot, but just specifying in one single purpose makes a ranger bad. Rangers are the jack of all trades, you don't roll a bar full of just interrupts for the same reasons you don't run a bar with just DPS increasing skills. It's just not optimal, and thus worse off. Call it "bad" if you want.

IllusiveMind · Jan 05, 2008, 02:10 AM // 02:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quaker

May I point out that DPS stands for Damage Per Second - which is damage over time, not the damage from one (or two) attacks. You seem to be looking for "spike" damage.

Yes you are right Quaker. I know what DPS means, so don't worry. I just posted that pic to show my highest spike damage done on 2 seconds. Isn't spike damage considered DPS as well?

Edit: According to GuildWiki, DPS is used more on pressure builds, opposite to spike damage (high damage on a very short period of time). I answered my own question.

Scary Raebbit · Jan 05, 2008, 04:05 AM // 04:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by IllusiveMind

Yes you are right Quaker. I know what DPS means, so don't worry. I just posted that pic to show my highest spike damage done on 2 seconds. Isn't spike damage considered DPS as well?

Edit: According to GuildWiki, DPS is used more on pressure builds, opposite to spike damage (high damage on a very short period of time). I answered my own question.

Any decent build is going to have enchants going off and you might face some hex pressure. (Unless you run Nr/Tranq lol) Forked Arrow will then shoot 1 arrow for ten energy which is bad.
So you're left with Dual Shot and Punishing Shot. So for 10 seconds, you have your thumb up your ass just plinking arrows instead of spreading poison and interrupts. Super high DPS there.
Then you have a window to DS then PS, but the damage isn't that great and will be wiped up by prot most of the time unless you are spiking with a warrior. There are better things that can spike with a warrior. Another Warrior, Paragon, Shell Shock, Shatter Enchant, etc. so why are you even trying to fit a Ranger into a role that it is not the best at.
You can try and spike with a Ranger, but I would think there is better use of it with other skills.

Wakka · Jan 05, 2008, 12:04 PM // 12:04

Quote:

Any decent build is going to have enchants going off and you might face some hex pressure. (Unless you run Nr/Tranq lol) Forked Arrow will then shoot 1 arrow for ten energy which is bad.

Yes, the only time Forked arrow may be useful is in a Ranger spike with [skill=text]Gaze of contempt[/skill] or some other enchantment removal. Other than that its almost useless in PvP.

Quaker · Jan 05, 2008, 04:41 PM // 16:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wyat Hawke

Well, why would you not want the optimal instead of sub-par? When something achieves something to an "lesser" extent, it is worse. You can't argue around that. And when it's worse, why shouldn't it be bad.

Well, for one thing - the OP is a Ranger. The other DPS things you're talking about are NOT rangers. Guild Wars is about playing a game and enjoying it - not about finding the "best" way to do things. If you want to play GW likes it's a competition to find the "best" - be my guest. But the OP obviousl;y wants to play his ranger and get the best DPS he can with a ranger.

Or, put another way - why does it have to be optimal?

Or put another way - what you're saying is that any mark less than A+ is "less than optimal", so must be "bad". So, if you come home and say to your parents "I got all A's on my exams", they should punish you for getting "bad marks".

Of course, I suppose that fits in with the "second place is just the first loser" type of idiot mentality.

Stormlord Alex · Jan 05, 2008, 04:49 PM // 16:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quaker

some waffling

lolol
Bows are bad for DPS.
A DPS marksman is pretty baed.

If the OP wants to max out his DPS as a ranger, he should go thumper.

/closethread

Wyat Hawke · Jan 05, 2008, 05:36 PM // 17:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quaker

Well, for one thing - the OP is a Ranger. The other DPS things you're talking about are NOT rangers. Guild Wars is about playing a game and enjoying it - not about finding the "best" way to do things. If you want to play GW likes it's a competition to find the "best" - be my guest. But the OP obviousl;y wants to play his ranger and get the best DPS he can with a ranger.

Or, put another way - why does it have to be optimal?

Or put another way - what you're saying is that any mark less than A+ is "less than optimal", so must be "bad". So, if you come home and say to your parents "I got all A's on my exams", they should punish you for getting "bad marks".

Of course, I suppose that fits in with the "second place is just the first loser" type of idiot mentality.

He asks for help to get a "single-target heavy dps ranger build". Okay, let's stick to that first, albeit we do not know if it's for PvE or PvP (I'm assuming PvP in my posts). When was GW PvP not a competition of being the best? There are no forms of PvP that doesn't include competition! Your arguments makes no sense, especially:

Quote:

why does it have to be optimal?

This argument makes no sense, it's like asking why we wouldn't want the best. When several choices occur, we must always try to pick the best. That makes sense right? If you want to reason that you don't need the most optimal build, then I can't argue at all with you, because it is nonsensical, in terms of GW it's like saying 2+2=3.

Try to look at it this way, if you run something sub-par instead of something that is optimal, wouldn't that worsen your performance? To use an analogy, not even Michael Schumacer would've been able to win any F1 races if he'd been driving in an old Ford from the 1980ies. It just makes sense, that once you have established the optimal platform or starting point, it's your personal skill in the game that takes you further. If you happen to battle someone with the exact same skill level as you, it's up to your builds to decide who wins. And losing not because you performed bad, but because your build did, that really sucks.

Oh, and please refrain from saying I've got an idiot mentality. What's that for an argument? Go for the discussion at hand, not the discusser...

Moonlit Azure · Jan 05, 2008, 05:38 PM // 17:38

Thumper is pretty good dps also.

Bows can do as much dps as an axe, in theory. Lets say a Ranger can kill a target in 22 seconds, and an axe warrior can kill in 20 seconds. Using the range of a bow, the Ranger can get in some shots before the warrior can use his axe. Then the dps is about equal.

But when theyre close in fighting, the axe/sword/hammer/etc will win.

[skill]favorable winds[/skill] might also be useful.

Quaker · Jan 05, 2008, 07:33 PM // 19:33

I have to admit that I don't know if the OP is doing PvP or PvE - it would be helpful if people would specicify in their post, as it does make a difference. But anyway....

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wyat Hawke

To use an analogy, not even Michael Schumacer would've been able to win any F1 races if he'd been driving in an old Ford from the 1980ies. It just makes sense, that once you have established the optimal platform or starting point, it's your personal skill in the game that takes you further.

But, to use your own analogy, Jeff Gordan asks "What can I do to improve my NASCAR speed" and you would reply "NASCAR doesn't do speed, go to F1"

Quote:

Oh, and please refrain from saying I've got an idiot mentality. What's that for an argument?

You are just paranoid. I was merely saying that I think "Second place is just the first loser" is an idiot mentality - I have no idea if that's your mentality. Don't get your knickers in a bunch.

Wyat Hawke · Jan 05, 2008, 07:52 PM // 19:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quaker

I have to admit that I don't know if the OP is doing PvP or PvE - it would be helpful if people would specicify in their post, as it does make a difference. But anyway....

But, to use your own analogy, Jeff Gordan asks "What can I do to improve my NASCAR speed" and you would reply "NASCAR doesn't do speed, go to F1"

You are just paranoid. I was merely saying that I think "Second place is just the first loser" is an idiot mentality - I have no idea if that's your mentality. Don't get your knickers in a bunch.

You're not getting it right with that analogy though, because F1 and NASCAR are different formats, just like GvG and HA is. You can't compare the two, that doesn't make sense because they are different. If Jeff Gordon wants the optimal speed, he ofc needs an optimal car (for his format), but don't you think he needs some skill as well? You haven't really answered my post, only tried to come up with a clever counter to the analogy (which is, an analogy, just supposed to make the arguments easier to see)

And, while you might not be saying directly to me that I've got this "mentality", you are implying it (quite clearly) however. It's off the topic, and you don't really help your own statement when you go on and say I'm paranoid, yes?